Women’s Clothing Berkeley

Burns was in addition the international founder Woman’s Party, a militant movement wing that ok techniques Burns had learned in London, including hunger strikes, violent clashes with authorities and jail sentences. While following on President heels Donald Trump’s inauguration this Friday, with protestors calling for gender equality. You mean like Christians, Jews, Hindi, Sufi, Amish, even Mormon women cover their heads to show their humility and faith. Let me ask you something. Why were probably you assuming that anyone is usually telling these women to cover their heads, let alone men? I like it when Berkeley gets in the news for peace, diversity and progressiveness. Normally, when appraising numerous contemporary value religions, Islam is a highly interesting case.

Loads of strictures imposed by patriarchal societies do stultify women. Obvious example was always the idea that women’s place was usually in the home and they shouldn’t work. We look for to inspire a brand new generation to get roles as leaders and educators, Keeble said Friday. Activism should be integral to the newmosque which has probably been slated focus on public justice and education. That’s my humble view on such issue given my Quran studies and Islam. With that said, for a summary of this debate see.https.//en.wikipedia.org/wi. Anyways, how do you see where to draw the line? Undoubtedly it’s interesting that you were always so keen on separating culture from religion. Usually were they special anyhow? KH has been a title, Khetib Amin, bestowed by the Yogyakarta sultanate. Needless to say, for those who don’t study Indonesian, what this refers to is a mushola establishment or praying place for women, led by women in 1922 by KH Ahmad Dahlan.

Whatever decision was usually reached -either leting women to lead prayer and praying in a mixed gender congregation or disallowing such -should not be stamped as a ‘Godordained directive.’ those societies which chose to disallow women from leading prayer or praying ‘sidebyside’ with their male counterparts, reasoning for doing so shouldn’t be.

Similarly, for those societies who chose to enable women to lead prayer and pray ‘side by side’ with their male counterparts, their reasoning for enableing such shouldn’t be.

Scripture says so! As alluded to above. Neither approving nor disapproving should approach said issue in a decent manner, quran is silent on this issue.

So, at newest opening mosque, Keeble demonstrated her commitment to making everyone feel welcome. She announced that accommodations had been madeforanyone men or women who wanted to pray separately from ourselves, when it came time for prayers. After that, they’ll turn it off completely when it boils down to peculiar cultures and religions, it oftentimes annoys me how Berkeley people probably were so swift to criticize all sorts of institutions and movements in regards to power imbalance. I wish this newest mosque good things and success. I am sure that the most probably perpetrator of violence against this mosque will maybe be a male fundamentalist Muslim, not a racist, islamophobic rightwinger. In addition, what doctrine did this mosque have faith in when they determined that it was permissible for women to lead men in prayer? As a result, it’s primarily haram, is it not? So, even if they have been inspired by some particular higher power, muhammad belonged to a culture, and his teachings, carry baggage from his culture. Yes, that’s right! These teachings are interpreted through all sorts of cultivated lenses as they was developed and spread globally. There is more info about it on this website. Men have oftentimes been physically stronger than women and have a lower risk/cost to reproduction, that perhaps gave patriarchy some momentum until it could happen to be woven into complex structures symbolusing societies.

Patriarchy, male dominance, is probably a phenomenon looked with success for ‘cross culturally’ though not in all cultures. Oftentimes through customs similar to marriage and inheritance practices, if male domination is usually established it tends to maintain itself through time. So I’d be more than lucky to engage in a lengthy academic debate with you pertaining to this issue, but we don’t believe that’s the appropriate venue for this debate, I actually dispute that. Whether they be Muslims or adherents of some next faith, I’ve in no circumstances argued otherwise, loads of us are aware that there are women, who are usually oppressed by men. By the way I would disagree, if you mean to tell me uslim women get the treatment they get being that religion ordain it so. Sounds familiar? Keeble hopes that newest mosque will draw Muslims from all backgrounds. Ok, and now one of the most crucial parts. Food and on she feels a blending of unusual heritages and opinions must be more productive, while she understands motivation shared norms. She describes mosques whereshe worshipsin East Bay, for sake of example, as having congregations that largely reflect civilized or civil roots. You have your starting point and they have mine, I suppose.

Therefore a graduate school and Unitarian Universalist seminaryon LeConte Avenue while King School for the Ministry.

We’ve got where they draw line.

Another good question. I usually can solely a solution it from a Islamic/Quran perspective. Seeing as how it also looks for no explicit support from the Quran, but contradicts it too, if a particular tradition of a culture of a Muslim nation contravenes Quran message, said tradition can’t be connected with Islam. Keeble admits that when she first conceived of women’s mosque, she thought it could be exclusively for women. In any case, she was persuaded that closing it up in that way will be acting merely like exclusionary patriarchy she is challenging., with no doubt, I am surely sure that in lots of enclaves in America So there’s coercion to Islamic rules. I think you refer to such paradises as Iran wheneverit gets to coercion. As you may see, decision actually depends on ones audience.

Therefore if that question has always been put to a Mormon he/she will invoke God as their source.

Certainly, respond differently, if you as a non Mormon he/she may.

Depends practically on who you ask. Speaking at the opening, Berkeley Mayor Jesse Arreguín welcomed mosque to city’s spiritual community and said it was especially good to have this particular allinclusive place of worship in current national climate. Now look. Deenf, who was born in Sri Lanka, doesn’t study Arabic or wear hijab, joked about being seen as a poor Muslim, and in addition spoke of her realization at 12 age that she was not welcome at a neighboring mosque. If you don’t like be judged a special way how about to defend yourself depending on your beliefs, So in case in America you choose to dress in a particular way hereafter go for it.

You didn’t like the original poster passing judgment on you for how you dress, so you make quite similar judgmental statement about another women. You make identical argument that you are complaining about. I know that the bottom line is that Christian faith requires acceptance of intricate mythological narratives, So there’re vast amount of variations to the mythology. Covenants with god, atonement and all that stuff. Mythological thinking is really normal to human mind, and Surely it’s useful for imparting wisdom that can’t be expressed explicitly. Christianity has been dependent on a complex story about why world needed Jesus and whatnot. Considering above said. Whenever hijacking minds that could’ve been more open and discerning, mythology has a seductive power that has always been beyond rationality and it justifies itself by its own terms. Ok, and now one of the most crucial parts. They have been extremely good at infecting human minds, Myths are highly successful memes.

While marveling at all harmony the parts referring to each other, mindlooping themselves farther and farther in, it seems that these myths have probably been primarily ‘selfconsistent’, and people cement their faith by dwelling inside these myth worlds.

Christianity, likewise, gets pretty tangled up in mythological thought.

It involves plenty of traps and it quite frequently weakens other more critical modes of thought. Finally, indeed she converted afterbeing raised nominally Christian, as, she says, Islam appealed to all her senses, spiritually and to her soul. With all that said… Keeble, a graduate of Starr Kingand Graduate Theological Union, stresses that she isn’t against Islam faith. As long as I have come to believe it was the opposite, I look for your own response fascinating. Please understand, I’m not promoting either side. Now regarding aforementioned fact… I’m simply stating my previous understanding. You will comfort me. They were always doing so being that they are probably following a religion that includes the scarf for a reason of male power, probably some women have not been first-hand ld to wear the headscarf by particular men.

I thank you for your thoughtful replies, and we would mostly like to hear our own case. Have you published papers anywhere, or do you have a blog of some sort? In meantime please bear patience with me as I have a lot on my plate at the moment, that urgently need my attendance. Although, I shall reply sometime Sunday. I welcome the reply and should be lucky to share with you my have this matter. That’s merely a difficulties few. It’s a well there’s human common repression drives, that creates pent up health energy that youthful men channel into a variety of negative avenues. There’re plenty of parts of Islam that have always been dangerous and incompatible with modernity. There’s all text that is quickly used to justify violence. Nonetheless, while something that has demonstrated itself throughout history and now, for the most part there’s will wards theocratic empire built in from the start. There’s women oppression, that even expresses itself through the brutal practice of FGM in Africa. Surely, virtually, To be honest I fully concur with the last paragraph. They came from male humans, who were in charge. Self maintenance’ of this power structure had been built into the religion. By the way, the rules about female dress and conduct did not come from a balanced agreement between men and women, and they did not come from a divine source.

I think the point has always been more that religion is shaped by patriarchy. There has often been an extreme power imbalance between men and women in Islamic society. Speaking solely from a Islamic/Quranic perspective, an otherwise cultivated act can’t be seen as Islamically motivated if said act can’t search for any clear support in Quran, and if it contravenes the Quran message. Undoubtedly it’s evident to any ardent Quran student, that the acts you’ve alluded to therewith won’t be able to search for any explicit support from Quran but they contradict it also. To be honest I must disagree with you, Therefore in case they understand you properly. Nevertheless, and I’m not sure where you pulled that bs from, Scripturally speaking.that’s actually not real. Consequently, I ask in advance that you kindly spare citing me those oftcited, bias, subjective cites in support of our own 2 assertions. All these exclusive faiths have pretty special ideas, and they all claim they come from god.

Usually were there big amount of gods, any talking to unusual peoples/religions? See how it works? Keeble, who converted to Islam 13 years ago, said idea for newest mosque was born from her frustration with way women have always been separated from men in most mosques, how they have always been expected to behave, and how they have been patronized by imams, mosque’s prayer leaders. Of course I am not an expert here, nor a Muslim, I remember a mushola as being less than a mosque. A well-prominent fact that usually was. I have a sign from the Krakatao Steel Works that says Do not sleep in mushola. Of course by fallowing Allah demands and have plenty of patience, religion ain’t by following desires. Therefore if you do not accept what Allah gave women and men consequently you need to check our own father.

Sister you should explore and have a grasp of the Qran and prophet Sunnah Muhammad Sala Allahu alyhi wasalam. But the question is whether covering their heads stultifies women and prevents them from realizing their full potential. See my comment above. Did you know that the systems within which they dwell been drastically shaped by patriarchy, if there hasn’t been direct coercion by individual men in these women’s lives. Extreme modesty for women completely? You should get it into account. Selflessness virtue could apparently emanate from a source beyond humanity, I am open to that. So it is case with most religions, it seems. With that said, thence, a particular amount its doctrines and habits been notably influenced by a power imbalance between males and females. Islam was born and grew within worlds that were fairly patriarchal. I don’t think so. It is everyone everywhere usually says that their rules and practices come from divinity. In no circumstances claimed I had all choice.

It’s one of the things to direct the inquiries wards me, it’s a whole other thing to associate me with views that they have not expressed. Last time I checked Muhammad was a man and he came up with all these cockamamie ideas like a woman’s head and face had to be covered and they are probably not leted to be equals amongst men. So that’s solely a convincing explanation if you consider that the Islamic teachings come from god. Nonmuslims, in addition, reckon that muslim women cover their head because of patriarchy. It’s awrite. Have you observed any one of those women being coerced to wearing head scarf? While seeing as how it searches for no explicit support from the Quran, said culture will still partake in said ritual but they CANNOT associate it with Islam nor should their reason for partaking in said ritual be seen as a ‘Allahordained’ directive.

Now, a question may arise. What if a particular tradition neither looks for support from Quran NOR contradicts it?My humble response my be. There’s my humble response to most of the issues/questions you raised. Hi jim butler, apologies for late reply. In additional societies they may / won’t object to women leading prayer nor to a mixed congregation prayer. In special societies they may / will disapprove of either women leading prayer or a mixed gender congregation. As long as decency is exercised, Qurans silence on this matter is meant to leave it to society to better decide how to go about this. I’m not sure where you pulled that bs from, Scripturally speaking.that’s just not very true.

I’m quite sure, that’s indeed the wise thing to do. It’s a pity more people do not share that view. That’s contrasted with Christianity, that is probably polytheistic or at least not far from it. Islam has a theological simplicity and coherence that is fairly elegant. Their faith was monotheistic. Their god has been the least anthropomorphic, the most ineffable and indescribable, and they have strict rules against depicting god visually. Of all the Abrahamic faiths, Islam has been most philosophically and theologically plausible. Then once again, islam rejects the idea that god will come to earth as a human being or that god exists as a trinity. Besides, claims need to be supported with data, or else don’t bother.

They are probably all still oppressed as long as men tell them to wear head coverings and they comply how will robust amount of women support a religion that oppresses plenty of women? All I hear has probably been silence, To be honest I don’t get it if this was a baptist church telling women how to dress there will be outrage and protests in street. Quran does not intend to address every doable human scenario and prescribe an ethical edict to it. Unusual people of unusual times and places interpret it within their own worlds in vastly special ways, it provides essential guidance. For one to get from it better meaning, apply it to some good stuff from one’s abilities. Generally, these special interpretations are conditioned by socioeconomic, historical, and cultivated contingencies. Like all religions in history, it is shaped enormously by downtoearth human factors. I do deeply respect a lot of facts of Islam, especially Sufism. Think for a moment. It was not as plain simple as choosing chocolate or vanilla. Since religion has been largely identity part you grow up with. Some information will be searched with success for on the web. I under no circumstances understood that.

Question. Why does God tell exclusive people to do special things? Now, a school, job, restaurant, usually can tell you what to wear but God cant? In the US they should hope that Muslim women have choice on what to wear although they doubt that is 100 very true,. This has usually been case. In America people should do as they wish as long as it does not harm another. You have confidence about Berkeleyside for neighboring news, right? This is where it starts getting intriguing. Support free nearest journalism by becoming a Berkeleyside member. Essentially, choose a monthly payment or a ‘one time’ contribution. On p of that, So there’re a hell of plenty of Hassan’s out there, bolywoord unsubstantiated claims about me, given our own plenty of that you may have me mistaken for some other fella. That said, before you, check yourself next year. I hope this newest mosque has good security protection.

With hate rising openness, the burning of a couple of mosques around country, and rising openness of oppression of all women, therefore this newest, good mosque seems like a potential target.

Please proven to be a member, if you value Berkeleyside and forum we provide for our community.

You’ll feel big for helping Berkeley’s leading independant, ‘readersupported’ news site. I’m not sure whether they would stand up for LGBT community, it says activism gonna be integral to the modern mosque. Likewise we thank you for the thoughtful and sincere replies/questions. Nor do I yet have a blog. Than you for our own compliment. I have not published any paper, individual issue have diverted much of my attention. Although, Surely it’s most plausible to expound these differences in regards to human constructions. Mormons wear extraordinary Mormon underwear. Where did that come from? You see, did it come from the deity they worship or did it come from humans in 19th century America? For we fear they may have unintentionally misunderstood some amount of our questions/statements, Therefore if they have not sufficiently addressed your question/concerns thence please let me understand.